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Post by Rory on Sept 17, 2014 0:32:51 GMT
I think she's in an abusive relationship. She's 19, in her second year of college, and she shares a house with a female friend who she went to high school with, though the friend is a few years older. They've been friends for a few years, but I noticed that they had gotten a lot closer during my daughter's senior year. So I've met the girl several times, and she seemed very nice, just quiet. I have suspected that my daughter is gay since she was about 13, but she hasn't said anything, and I haven't outright asked. I thought she'd tell me when she was ready. She dated a few different boys in high school, and she seemed happy.
My worries about her and this friend began in May of last year, shortly after my daughter moved out. They were in a car accident. The friend was driving and lost control of the car. She hit a tree on the passenger's side, where my daughter was sitting. She had a fractured humerus and several broken ribs. On the way to the hospital, her lung collapsed. By the time I got there, she'd had surgery and was in the ICU, but the doctors said she would be okay. The next morning, she was moved into a regular room. When I came to visit her that day, her friend was there. They were both crying, and the friend kept saying, "I'm sorry. I'm so sorry. Please don't leave me." I thought it was odd she said don't leave me, because the doctors had said she was fine. That was all I could think of at the time, that her friend was telling her not to die. It didn't hit me what she may have actually meant until much later. It was a long recovery for her. Her whole side looked like a giant bruise. After she was released from the hospital, I asked her to come back home, it was summer, and she'd have time to rest and heal. But she said no, she wanted to stay where she was. Before I went back home, her friend said, "Don't worry, I'll take care of her." A few months later, I saw a very dark, almost black, bruise on her back. She said she slipped on the stairs and landed on her back. It didn't seem right, but I didn't want her to think I was behind an overprotective mom (she's always been very independent), so I put the thought out of my mind. I have asked her several times if there is something more going on than what she is telling me, but she gets annoyed and denies it. I've seen her with other bruises, a bump on her head, which she blamed on the freezer door, scratches on her arms too wide and too far apart to have come from their cat, even a welt on her stomach, like from a belt! She missed Christmas last year because she had to work, and Easter because she had too much studying to do. Sometimes when she calls, I can tell she's been crying or that she's upset, but she'll deny it.
I had my three older kids very young (16 with my oldest), and I was in an abusive relationship and marriage myself for several years. But my 19- year old was just a baby when I got out, so she didn't witness anything. She was also always the feisty one. I always thought she was the one I wouldn't have to worry about. She's grown up with an amazing stepfather. I don't understand why she'd tolerate being treated this way. For me, I tolerated it because I had children with him, and my mother taught me that if you make your bed, then you lie in it. She's still married to a man who treats her like crap and who "raised" us with a belt in one hand, it seemed like. But I taught my girls different. Or I thought I did. I realize that I could be wrong, that maybe nothing is going on. I hope that's the case! I just know that my daughter played soccer, softball and cross country in high school and she never had injuries like I've seen on her! She's never been a crier, or prone to depression. Holidays have always been a big deal to us, and she could have just as well studied at home over spring break, but she stayed back.
Am I being paranoid here? I would think having been in an abusive relationship myself, I wouldn't question myself so much, but I still do.
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janine
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Post by janine on Sept 17, 2014 2:57:39 GMT
I believe you are onto something. A mother's intuition is usually very right on, and what I am hearing is typical belittling and excuses from a victim of domestic violence.
What you can do is in a quiet moment- maybe when you pick her up from college for a dinner/lunch/ shopping trip that you say calmly:
I love you very much. Please hear me out, you do not have to reply and I will not mention this again until you want to. I have seen your injuries and I want you to know none of this was ever your fault. I believe you are in an abusive relationships. Your life can be at stake and I and your siblings love you and do not want to lose you. There is free counseling on campus, here is the number. If you want to we can make an appointment together right now. I can also come and go with you to the first appointment and we can say to your partner we are only going to have a mother/daughter day. I love you, care for you and am always here. I understand the thought of leaving might make you feel scared or angry at me even. Abuse is complex and you are probably suffering from post traumatic stress."
Being a family member of an abused child is very difficult. The scary thing is my gut told me her partner caused a car accident maybe during a fight- she might have threatened suicide of your daughter left her. Being older means she can easily control your daughter.
You should also call the college counseling services and mention your concerns- she is over 18 years but I bet there are programs and outreach plans in place- the right people need to know and help you in the best possible way. You can easily find the counseling services on the Uni's website- and you can call and ask if they have a therapist specialized in domestic violence issues.
The college she is at might also have a hotline for concerned parents- research anything you can find to involve people right there.
I am glad you found us, and I am glad you care about her. She needs you, even if she pushes you away right now and might not yet be ready to talk about it. But she will be. Sometimes we have to wait until a victim is ready- which is scary and dangerous and hard. That is why reaching out to the professional counseling services could be a lifeline for her and you.
hang in there, keep us updated how the research went and what counseling services and other support on campus said!!
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Post by Rory on Sept 17, 2014 21:52:35 GMT
Hi Janine,
I called the university this morning. They have a sexual assault and domestic violence outreach program on campus. They have flyers displayed all over campus and speak once a month about their services and other services available. I called them and they said that although they cannot approach an individual student, if a student comes to the health center and a nurse suspects any abuse, she will try to get the student to contact the outreach center, or counseling services. They also gave me a number to a hotline that I or my daughter can call, 24/7. They also have security escort services after dark, for anyone who feels unsafe to walk to their car. Since my daughter lives with her abuser, that doesn't really help, but I'm glad it's there, in case she does decide to leave. They basically gave me the same advice you did. Because she's an adult, they cannot intervene unless she asks them to, or she is in immediate danger, basically someone would have to see her being assaulted on campus. So that's what I found out so far. I wish someone could pull her aside and say, "Hey, you don't have to put up with this anymore. You deserve better. We can help you." I know I can say it, but I think she'd be more willing to listen if it wasn't coming from her mom. She's always been so independent. She's been working since she was 12. Ever since she was a little girl, it's been, "No, I can do it myself!" She even almost didn't let me pay her tuition, until she did the math and realized she didn't have a choice. So I think that's part of it. She doesn't want me to think she can't make it on her own. I'm very proud of her, but now I'm afraid her attitude is hurting her.
It sounds crazy, but talking about this has started to bring back memories for me, 18 years later. I used to go weeks or months without thinking about it, but it's all been coming back. Remembering how it felt when I was going through the abuse myself, just makes it so much harder knowing my daughter could be experiencing the same fear, pain and humiliation. It makes a mom feel useless. I can only hope that she will hear me out.
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janine
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Post by janine on Sept 17, 2014 23:09:56 GMT
That was a very loving thing you did by talking to the services on campus!
I bet this triggers a lot of your own traumatic memories, like you described. Maybe this could be a good time too for you to reach out to a counselor yourself. I usually advise people to google "red flag of a bad counselor" first, as like in ANY profession not all therapists are good, or some are good but may not be a good fit for you and your situation. Trust your gut along this road- it seems you have already detected a lot of facts by feeling what you did and trusting it.
We really cannot change or control someone into getting help-sadly! It is very hard for loved ones of abuse victims, or addiction victims to watch the story unfold. One thing I believe counseling might be helpful for you at this point- having someone professional to talk to- would be to make sure IF she does approach you, that this is all about HER. Not you.
Sometimes trauma victims feel a so called 'secondary victimization' if family members or friends etc. react in ways that are not helpful. A counselor could help you work on the right words for you to say to her etc. and how to be an 'anker' for her during this time while she is living with abuse.
Despite that I believe having the ONE time talk (or a letter!!) can be extremely helpful. If you feel she would prefer a letter- give it to her at a safe time and make sure she has time and safety to read it. Tell her to throw the letter away too so her partner does not find it. Or if a personal talk might work do that and calmly state to her how you felt (like i mentioned above) and that you will be there no matter when and love her no matter what she does.
Giving back control to abuse victims is the no. 1 priority, it is all about empowering them
you can do this!!!
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Post by Rory on Sept 18, 2014 0:36:42 GMT
Thanks, Janine. I think you are right. I'm going to find a counselor. I don't want my daughter to think that I'm making my past her issue. I'm certain I would be worried even if I hadn't been there myself. I do second guess myself a lot, but everything in my bones is telling me something is not right. I see it in her eyes. She used to be glowing, all the time. Now she's withdrawn, and she just looks--tired. If I'm only going to get one chance to say something to my daughter, I don't want to mess it up.
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Post by Rory on Sept 20, 2014 1:39:39 GMT
Well, I got some more information from my oldest (24-year old) daughter. I don't like fishing my kids for information on their siblings, but when it comes to their safety, I'll do anything. So, she said my 19-year old has been in a relationship with this girl for over 2 years! She said she was sworn to secrecy in the beginning, but she figured I knew by now. Nope. Clueless old mom. Anyway, I shared my concerns with her, and she said her sister hasn't said anything to her about anything like that, and if she had, she (my 24-yo) would have told me. And they have always been very close. My middle (22-year old) daughter is currently in a graduate program overseas, so I don't think she'd know anything. My other two are too young to discuss this with. But at least I know the truth, that they are not "just friends". I wish I knew why she feels like she can't tell me.
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janine
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Post by janine on Sept 20, 2014 15:17:13 GMT
Maybe now could be a good time to tell your daughter that you support her in her sexual orientation - and that it does not matter for you who she is with, as long as she is happy. She might come across very self-confident, but I think behind a self-confident coat there is more than often someone who might be waiting for the hand to reach out. Even if she is not opening up right away, the seeds are planted.
You could also still choose to say you are concerned about the way she is being treated, and that you support her in no matter what she chooses to do or not do. I would also mention that campus has free counseling and that she does not have to suffer in silence if something is heavy on her heart.
Being a family member or close friend of someone who is being abused is hard. You cannot push them more - because their every move is already controlled and their body is on high adrenaline and completely traumatized. A lot of toxic shame and guilt add to the isolation. Your daughter might be threatened by her partner to not even tell her sister about what is going on.
Abusers are very manipulative and talented in isolating their victims from ALL family members, and even the closest and oldest friends. This happens so slowly, the victim almost never sees it coming and wakes up one day wondering what happened to her life and why she drew back from family and friends. If you choose to have one conversation with her, pick a safe spot. Maybe when you do a daughter/mom college visit day or something. Tell her all you ask form her is to listen for one minute, state your concerns- offer to be there whenever she needs you. Inform her about resources and then let her know you will not bring the topic up again unless she chooses to.
Like the counseling department at the Uni said- she is an adult and unless she chooses to get help and reach out - she is most likely not ready to leave or accept her circumstances. It is sad and hard to watch- but she sounds strong from what you described and she is in an environment where her partner cannot control her 100% given she has to go to classes etc. and has health services right around the corner.
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Post by Rory on Sept 20, 2014 19:48:29 GMT
I'm headed up there this afternoon. It was pre-planned. I'm torn on whether to say something, and if I do, what exactly to say. I want to get my point across without sounding like I'm trying to tell her what to do. I understand what you're saying, about not pushing her. It is so hard, as her mom, to not be able to protect her the way I want to. But I know that when I was in my first marriage, if someone had used pressure to try to get me to leave, I'd probably have gotten angry and pushed the person away. I might even still be with him. If I was still alive. I made the decision to leave for good on my own, after a particularly cruel incident, which was basically, the straw that broke the camel's back. I'd had friends and family who had expressed concern but I wasn't even thinking about that when I made my decision. And I know it will have to be the same for my daughter.
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janine
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Post by janine on Sept 20, 2014 21:58:40 GMT
Very wise words! And you have my compassion for what you experienced in your first marriage. Nobody deserves to experience domestic abuse. I am very glad you are reaching out, this must be a very challenging time for you as well. Not only does it bring back your own traumatic memories and can trigger PTSD symptoms in you, but it involves your child now.
Trust her that she is an adult and will reach out when the time is right. Until then, state one time calmly that you are concerned and that you will let her decide if/when she wants to talk about it. It will be hard- but try not to try or spend too long with it. Whatever she chooses to do as a response, let it be. Accept it- cry and scream on the way home in the car if you feel like it.
Like you said she will push anyone away who tries to come between her and the abuser most likely. But knowing you know, understand and are an anchor, can be her lifeline.
You can do this!
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Post by Rory on Sept 21, 2014 3:35:41 GMT
Hi Janine, Thanks, you're so sweet. Yes, it's brought some things back for me, especially that last day, but I have to say, it's so much easier to cope with this time around. I had PTSD so bad when I first left that I once went 3 straight days without sleeping and had to be given a sedative. Now I can just take some deep breaths, know that it's over, and go on. So, the visit with my daughter wasn't a complete disaster. I picked her up at her house. Her partner and I exchanged pleasantries, and then her partner told her not to be too late, and not to forget they had plans to go out with friends later. I bit my tongue. Hard. We got to the restaurant, ordered an appetizer, and I said what I had to say (basically what you advised) and she did admit that she and her partner were not just friends. She said she doesn't know why she didn't tell me, except she didn't want to be labeled, because she likes men, too. I said that's fine with me, I don't care if she loves a man or a woman, as long as she's happy and safe. Aside from that, she basically said, thank you, but I'm okay, really. Only, I could tell that she was not okay. But I did it, I held my tongue! I said, okay, I'm always here for you if you ever need anything, or want to talk, I love you, etc., and that was it. We had a nice dinner. Lots of small talk, and talk about college, but it was pleasant enough, even if she did seem a little distant. And quiet. She used to talk our ears off. I tried not to let on, but it was the hardest thing I've ever had to do. I can only pray that she'll feel safer now to confide in me, and soon. I have to tell you, I appreciate all of your help! It means so much to me that you took the time to read and respond to my posts. It's made this whole thing a little bit easier to deal with. So thank you!
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janine
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Post by janine on Sept 21, 2014 13:35:07 GMT
Wow, well done Rory!!!
I read this and felt very good in my gut about how you handled the situation- I could have not done it better myself. Give yourself a ton of credit for this. Now the seed is planted. She knows she can trust you, you respect her boundaries and are there- waiting for whenever she is ready. And she will be! Prayers sounds like a great way to give this away to a higher power. You did something VERY important for your daughter there. And I can only imagine how hard it was to bite your tongue - so respect again. We are always here if you would like an ear again or would prefer to run a situation by us. Even the members who do not reply, will find answers from your experience they can use in their own life. We often have people read posts for a few months or years before they feel strong enough to share, so thank you for bringing your story to us. It is very personal and difficult to deal with abuse.
As for your experiences- If you feel like you would like to talk to a good counselor, do that. But by no means feel like you have to. Sometimes abuse is like a muddy aquarium, if we keep putting a stick into it, and whirl it around and around the dirt never settles and the water remains muddy. That is why sometimes victims or survivors of abuse prefer a break from the issue, let the dirt settle and see clear again.
We are here.
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Post by Rory on Sept 21, 2014 23:34:28 GMT
Hi, I'm still going to go ahead and find someone to talk to. I left my ex 18 years and 7 months ago. The first couple of years were extremely difficult, but after that, I had 15 years where the waters, as you said, had mostly cleared. The nightmares and flashbacks got to be rare. I got remarried 12 years ago and had 2 more kids. I didn't think about it most of the time. I felt normal. Then when I began to worry about my daughter and her relationship last year, it started to come back. On a milder scale, thankfully. But when I go to bed at night, I have trouble going to sleep because I'm wondering if my daughter is okay. Is she in a corner crying? Did her partner hurt her today? Did she tell her how worthless she is, make her believe believe that she is too weak and stupid to make it on her own? Because that's what my ex did to me. And then I finally fall asleep and get woken up by nightmares. Like I said, I can cope with it. But my therapist was a lifesaver those first few years. I started seeing her again before I remarried. I'd always said that I'd never marry again. I'd never let myself be that vulnerable again. My therapist really helped me see that I could trust him, and feel safe making that commitment. Sadly, my old therapist has retired, so I'll have to find a new one. But the therapy was a huge help back then and I figure it can't hurt. If I can just get back to sleeping semi-normally, that would be great. I have a 9-year old and 7-year old at home who need me.
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janine
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Post by janine on Sept 22, 2014 13:54:15 GMT
I am so glad to hear you worked so hard at healing and daring life again- that is great news for anyone who is reading your post right now (and I can see we got a ton of views on your story) and is not sure if they can leave- wondering if they will ever find a normal man and marry again.
The key to healing I find is often a good counselor, like you described. The good thing is now you have a standard and are able to pick a good new counselor. Like any profession there can be good and a few bad ones. Feeling empowered to choose the right one is so important.
And I can relate to your memories and concerns about your daughter- knowing what goes on behind closed doors is a nightmare- at the same time you will be her rock when she does eventually get out and feels like it must have been her fault. You will be ready, arms open, understanding that you want to work on your own pain with a therapist and be there fully as a mom- offering compassion and support to her.
My nightmares sometimes come back- but all in all I also can say therapy helped me to turn it around and I rarely even think of my ex anymore, even when I write about my experiences. You do get desensitized and it is nothing but a story to share- no more intense emotions attached to it and life is happy and safe.
I am glad she has you.
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Post by Rory on Sept 24, 2014 21:28:21 GMT
Hey Janine, My daughter just called and asked if she could come home for the weekend. I said of course, what's going on? She said she didn't want to talk about it, she just wants to spend the weekend here. So, I don't want to get my hopes up, but she never comes home anymore. We always visit her there. I'm so happy she's coming, but if she doesn't want to talk, this is going to be hard. I promised I wouldn't bring up her relationship again. What if she's hurt? If I see marks on her again, how am I going to hold my tongue and pretend they're not there? I'm going stir crazy. Well at least my oldest daughter and my grandbabies are coming tomorrow--that should provide a little distraction.
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janine
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Post by janine on Sept 24, 2014 22:11:31 GMT
Good news! Try and be the anchor she needs. I hope you guys have a relaxing weekend and if she is ready, she will bring it up.
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Post by Rory on Sept 26, 2014 23:56:06 GMT
She is here! As soon as she walked in, I breathed a huge sigh of relief. At least for the weekend, I know she's safe. She sent her partner a text to let her know she made it. Within five minutes her partner called. All I heard was, "I didn't know you wanted me to call." She took the rest of the call in another room. I heard her crying. But she had dried her eyes and didn't say anything when she came out, so neither did I. I know it's wrong, and it wouldn't help, but right now I feel like going to their house and getting violent myself. I hate that I want to protect my baby and I can't.
Also, my 9-year old has started asking questions. What's wrong with her? Is she okay? Is she sick? I don't know what to say to him. How do I have a discussion with him about it when I don't even know what is going on for sure? Or is he too young? He's very good at reading people, so there's BS'ing him. He'll know.
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janine
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Post by janine on Sept 27, 2014 0:22:00 GMT
I expected her girlfriend to try and ruin the experience at home.
I would let your daughter relax tonight- get a good night sleep....and enjoy being home. As for your son, you tell him that "I see what you mean and I can see too that she might be sad. But we want to respect that she is not yet ready to tell us what makes her sad. When she is ready, she will tell us. Thank you for being so compassionate and kind to recognize something is wrong with her."
Something like this where you validate his observation of reality and his feelings, let him know you see how he feels and what he sees, but that right now all the power is with your daughter to choose what her steps are. Give her a hug, hold her, have fun with her. This is a huge step for her to want to be home.
I totally relate to wanting to drive to her partner and protect your baby. It is good you realize this urge in you and share it with us. Try and keep it from your daughter- after all she will still have strong feelings for her partner- a mix of fear and perceived love etc.-- the result of her traumatic experience with her. Often times victims of abuse push anyone away who is attacking the abuser directly. Many victims of abuse actually attack police after THEY themselves called police on their abuser- trauma is so complex....
Try and enjoy this. Maybe focus on things you did with her, things she loved BEFORE she met this girl. And then also some dreams about the future, HER own future. Maybe some idea of a family vacation she will be taking with you guys- just hope....anything that reminds her there is a life outside of the abuse she probably is experiencing right now.
And when you say good night to her tonight- give her a hug and reaffirm you are always there for her and love her and are proud of her no matter WHAT. And that your arms and your door are always open for her- no matter the time or reason.
You can do this!!!!!
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Post by Rory on Sept 28, 2014 6:05:14 GMT
Thanks Janine, We had a good day today. She went to bed early last night and slept in this morning. She seemed like she was feeling better when she got up. We went for a drive up into the mountains and stayed until the sun went down. She loves photography and taking pictures. When she was ten, we got her her first digital camera, and she told us that she was going to be in National Geographic someday. So, that's what we did. Took lots and lots of pictures. We about froze our butts off, but the gorgeous sunset was so worth it. She still didn't say much, though. She was pretty quiet. But she did seem more calm and relaxed. I brought up maybe taking a trip to Alaska next year, because she's always wanted to see the Northern Lights. She smiled and said she'd love that. Best response I could have hoped for! Also, there was no reception up where we were, so she wasn't bothered with phone calls. She fell asleep on the way home. I don't know how much of it is the working and going to school full-time, and how much is everything else, but I've never seen her this tired. I do wish she had opened up more, but it was wonderful just to have her with me and getting to spend time together. I hope she'll remember today and it will have an impact.
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janine
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Post by janine on Sept 28, 2014 14:38:03 GMT
You did one wonderful job there as a mother. If I were her, this would have totally recharged me and left me with a seed in my heart that will keep on growing. That seed would be labeled "I could be this happy and am when I am around other people and not my abusive partner." You not only reminded her of one of her earliest passions - she also now has a future hope picture installed with maybe going to Alaska- something to look forward to. And she seems to have felt so safe that she slept a lot when she was around you - all very, very important things. And even though she may not have talked about things that you wish she had, believe me she KNOWS now you are there, she knows you care. She WILL open up at the right time, when she is ready. You allow her to feel empowered around you, to feel loved and supported and you let her BE who she is. All those are things abusers slowly try to strip away from you. And in my opinion I think you guys should more often drive into the countryside or mountains where there is no cell phone reception Now two things could happen - either her partner goes all crazy about her 'not texting/calling' during this time as much as she was expected to. So an escalation of control and maybe violence, making her walk on eggshells/'punishing' her for having left and having had fun and rediscovered who she is and always will be--- or the partner goes into a honeymoon phase, trying to be all kind and nice to make your daughter doubt she is abusive. Either way, she knows you are a safe haven and an anchor now, that is all you can do for now and keep on doing. Well done!!
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Post by Rory on Sept 28, 2014 22:44:45 GMT
Oh, God, I hope her partner doesn't let it out on her because she maybe couldn't get through to her phone. I know that's the way it would have gone with my ex. But my daughter didn't *seem* very stressed about it when she realized there was no signal, so maybe it will go the other way. She did call as soon as she was able to.
I just said goodbye to her. She's on her way back home now. I hate this. I want my little girl back.
In a way, I feel guilty for letting her move out so young. I'm so proud of her, but I feel like I should have made her wait. She'd gotten a job, but she had to start in May (last year) so she took her finals and graduated high school early. She was two months from her 18th birthday, and so I had to co-sign the lease on that house she and her partner are sharing. Maybe I should have insisted on dorm housing. Maybe things would be different for her. Maybe, maybe.
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