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Post by Guest on Jan 13, 2019 18:04:12 GMT
Hi Karen,
This almost gets into the "hurt people hurt people" setup, which is false, and so, so very dangerous. We must not feel pity for abusers.
There are plenty who have been denied loving parents, denied attentive others in their formative years, and they did not become abusers or narcs. Its a rabbit hole to go down the path of 'poor narcs' they must be miserable. No. Don't do it. Don't fall for that nonsense. It's not true.
It's like those who pity bullies, in claiming they must not be very happy or fulfilled people and that's why they bully. Nope. It's a matter of evil, a matter of wickedness, and a matter of crappy, poor character. Bullies enjoy themselves and they do what they do because it works. Terrorize others, tear down others, and stand taller atop the heap of abused victims. Yup, that's success, not some poor, disturbed, miserable bully forced to be a tyrant because his formative years were or weren't this or that. Bullies are delighted to stand atop of a heap of victims. They are immensely happy tyrants. You are making the mistake of projection. You would feel miserable, but abusers are not. They don't give a darn what damage they inflict on victims, so long as their tactics work and they get whatever they want at that moment. And they are supremely happy with themselves. They sleep just fine at night. They are not miserable, but rather see themselves as successful warriors, mini-gods, plundering at will, and this all puffs them up to no end. Do not pity the narcs. There's a ton of bad books and bad information out there about poor abusers, they were weaned from mother's breast too early.....blah, blah, blah, ......but such is nonsense. Do not fall for it.
Victims and targets cannot afford to fall down these rabbit holes. Narcs make mince meat out of others because they want to do so, IT'S FUN FOR THEM, and it strokes their immense egos and sadistic appetites to do so. They want to be mini-gods and see themselves as such. What you are reading misled you. Narcs are evil people. Do not pity the wicked. Abusers versus narcs, doesn't matter how or why, what matters are the victims.
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karen
Member
"Trust Your Journey"
Posts: 1,518
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Post by karen on Jan 13, 2019 21:44:49 GMT
Hi Guest, We are going to have to agree to disagree. I agree with you that "they do what they do and it works". I completely agree that Narcs and Abusers are purposeful people with their behaviors and actions. I don't feel sorry for them at all.
What is your source of information? I am really wanting to know. I agree with you that it is "fun for them", that it strokes their immense egos and sadistic appetites. I have not been misled. I agree with many of your statements, "They are immensely happy tyrants", outwardly yes. I believe That is what they want you to see. And I agree, they don't give a damn what damage they inflict on victims, so long as their tactics work and they get whatever it is they want. I believe..that all they do is done to make them happy as they are not happy to begin with. And never truly will be. They are miserable underneath and the only way they become happy is to hurt others, to bully others, to use those hurtful tactics because it works and gets them what they want.
Not understanding what you mean about "projection" and how I am making it a mistake??
ALso, I agree there is alot of miss information out there.
I don't pity them. I agree they sleep well at night.
And I agree that not all HURT PEOPLE, HURT PEOPLE.
But I am standing by my statement. They are miserable, unhappy people inside and the horrible things they do to other people is to relieve them of their misery, therefore feeling quite happy and satisfied with themselves. That is evil. Yes.
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Post by Wrecked on Jan 19, 2019 14:50:10 GMT
I've been so ashamed to post this. You all have been so supportive and helpful and I'm so sorry. I went back 3 weeks ago. Just after Christmas, I was meeting my mom for dinner. and he must have followed me. It was dark, he approached me from behind, startled me, and I when I saw it was him I pushed him and told him to leave me the hell alone. He looked surprised, as I've never fought back before, but he continued to follow me. He said he just wanted to talk, he was pleading with me to talk to him. I was okay, I just kept walking towards the restaurant and I completely intended to call the police, but then he grabbed me by my shoulder and I lost it. I just started punching him. I punched him in the mouth so hard I split his lip. This rage has been building up inside of me and it just all came out it at once. Everyone--my mom, my friends, the counselor--kept telling me I'm not crazy, but I'm not so sure anymore. I didn't even feel like I was there, like I was watching it from the outside. I didn't stop until he pushed me down. He said I was insane. He said he should call the police and have me arrested but maybe he wouldn't if we could talk. I started to run and he said if I did I'd be going jail. I've seen him manipulate the police multiple times and I knew he could get them to press charges against me. I was so afraid of going to jail. So I agreed to see him after dinner and to put it plainly, I broke down. He didn't even call me crazy or mad or insane, but I was convinced I was. He told me things would be different, he said he'd never use those words again, he'd never lay a hand on me again. He said he loved me and he knew he's been wrong, so wrong. Why didn't I see through it? I should have seen through it.
Things were really good for about a week and a half and since then I've seen him returning to his old ways. He hasn't called me names but he lunged at me earlier this week and really scared me. I told him if he ever did that again I was gone and he slapped my face, not hard, but mockingly, and said he'd make sure I had a place to stay. He's holding jail above my head and I'm just frozen. I'm googling things like "what is jail like" and "getting a job with a domestic violence conviction" and I'm just too afraid to face it. I have told myself over and over that I'm crazy for staying, I tell myself whatever happens, if I go to jail or whatever, it's better than living like this. But then I get ready to leave and this voice inside tells me I'll never be able to support myself, no one will hire me, I'm an emotional mess, I'll be stuck living with my mom forever if I'm lucky, or put into a psychiatric hospital. No matter how much I try to tell myself that what I'm feeling is normal given everything he has done to me, I don't feel normal. I know I need help but I don't know how to get up the courage to get it and to walk away again.
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Post by thesadnessinme on Jan 19, 2019 18:36:25 GMT
Wrecked, I don’t have much advice I just wanted to offer my compassion. Please don’t think it’s hopeless, it definitely must feel like it but there has to be a way to get through all of this. Hoping someone more knowledgeable will post later and give you some solid advice.
You’ve done amazingly. Unfortunately you’ve been let down by the police here, I’ve read your whole thread. You husband manipulating them is very common sadly, abusers seem to be naturally skilled at getting people on their side and almost feeling sorry for them. But they should be more wise than to get sucked into this, it just highlights a huge fundamental problem with domestic violence and how it’s not taken seriously enough- and how there isn’t enough training where there should be. I’m in the UK and heard similar stories here.
You’ve tried, you’ve done so many brave things and managed to get away, and you WILL find a way out of this predicament now. I see your violence against him as self defence to be honest and I wonder if authorities would too, however I am NOT trained or skilled in this area so please try to get professional help. Call your domestic abuse helpline for advice, it’s confidential and they will advise you better.
Always here to listen.
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Post by anonymous on Jan 21, 2019 8:13:03 GMT
I see it as possible self defense, too. You were meeting your mom for dinner. He was stalking you and therefore breaking the restraining order and continuing to put you in fear. He grabbed your shoulder, after creeping up on you from behind. Many women would punch. Probably was at night, too.
It takes multiple attempts to successfully leave. The average number is 7.
But, be super careful. Try to make sure you do not lay a hand on him. He is baiting you. Had his lip not been bleeding and his threatening sending you to jail (such a common tactic for abusers, too) you wouldn't be with him right now. So, it's not like you are voluntarily there and all.
Try and stay out of jail, don't take the bait. Control your rage. Break dishes. Burn his clothes, but don't push, punch or anything. Women do get arrested and then they lose custody battles based on false charges. You're smart enough to consider what it's like having to job search with a DV conviction. Your abuser has made sure you dropped charges against him by now, yes? And the dual restraining orders?
Your mom's house sounds like a dream!!!! Thank goodness you have family! Otherwise, start researching other counties' DV shelters and how to get there, as you know he's going to attack you again, right? Doesn't matter what the liar says, he'll beat you again, sooner or later.
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karen
Member
"Trust Your Journey"
Posts: 1,518
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Post by karen on Jan 21, 2019 16:44:51 GMT
Hey Wrecked, I agree with anonymous. He is baiting you, it is like he is setting a trap so he can then have the upper hand and make it look like you are the problem. Please, I know it is hard, and I know you feel shame. It is ok. We are here, no judging. We all have been there, we all get it.
He wants to make you afraid, he wants to let you know he has power over you by threatening jail. Please, don't fall for this. Don't give him power.
Even call the National Hotline and talk to a counselor, they can help to give you guidance.
One thing we survivors struggle to do is change that "self talk" in our heads. That voice inside you telling you that you can't support yourself? That voice is listening to HIM. You can do it, you can rebuild, you can start over. AND..I know it is terrifying, it is incredibly risky and scary..but you don't have to do it alone. You are not alone! There are counselors, safe houses, job training, there is a lot of help out there for victims of abuse. ABUSE is very real, and the very fact that all those supports are there? It is because society recognizes that it is real. Take advantage of all the support out there..you can be successful.
Everyday, write on a piece of paper..."I can do it". Next day write "I am good enough"...Next day "I will be OK". Everyday take a moment and tell yourself these affirming things. Soon, you will begin to believe them.
Anonymous is right, he will hurt you again, it isn't a matter of "if" but "when". Please, don't give him the opportunity. Even though it is an average of 7 times before victims stay away for good, it doesn't have to be that for you. You have every right to happiness, you deserve it. You are a great person, who deserves to have a good life. And that "good life"..it is out there.
You don't have to live with your Mom forever. Perhaps, set one goal. Set a time frame. Focus on just one thing at time.
Perhaps for now, call the hotline and work on a plan. Take it one step at a time. In the mean time, try and find an outlet for your rage..and believe me, as much as he deserved every punch you laid on him..you don't want to get arrested. Jail isn't better.
It will be OK Wrecked. It will. Take a walk, exercise (find a pillow to punch), run or jog, or swim, whatever it is you enjoy. Find time to help you to breathe, to sleep, to eat, drink water, and take care of you.
We are here..always.
Karen
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Post by anonymous on Jan 21, 2019 19:57:02 GMT
Also, try and think about how bad it will feel to forever be explaining the DV conviction you got because of this abuser successfully setting you up and baiting you. Not only jobs but rental places do criminal background checks, so housing is greatly affected, too. And that becomes everyone's first (and potentially lasting) impression of you.
Please see about going to a DV shelter. Abusers don't stop. They've been working all their lives at setting others up, baiting people, manipulating, lying, impression management and so forth. Who is to say he didn't take pictures of his bloody lip and store such evidence away? I bet you he not only digitally recorded it, but he made sure to show everyone and tell as many people as possibly about how you punched him and bloodied his lip!
What happens if your abuser now starts with inflicting head injuries, Wrecked? It'll affect you forever. Brain damage is for life. Beating your head against the floor, violently shaking you, suffocating you, or any number of other things. And you'll be reeling from brain injuries and unable to think straight, to know and be able to take yourself to the hospital. He'll leave you laying on the floor, beaten unconscious.
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Post by Reese on Jan 22, 2019 6:36:00 GMT
Wrecked, this won't be long as I'm not able to focus well for long but please listen to me. What anonymous said about brain injuries is very real. I hope you don't mind me telling my story. I has been a long time since I have been here. I came to this forum before I left my husband near 4 years ago after 15 years of abuse. Not long after he stalked me, tried to kidnap me and then left me unconscious. I had memory loss of the event and then it came back and they, the doctors said I was doing better and thought I would recover completely or nearly completely. But after going back to work it all crashed down. I started having these symptoms of not being able to concentrate, short term memory loss, dizziness. I went downhill after that, it just got worse. Maybe 2 weeks after I made my last post I wanted to come back here and post an update and I couldn't remember the name of the forum or how to get here. It was one of the scariest moments I had to face. I could not deny it anymore. I had to leave my job after 11 years and I had to move in with my dad. It was huge blow as I loved my job, was finally free of my husband and ready to be on my own. It was just after that when I had a PET scan and had physical proof of the brain injury. I have undergone years of TBI therapy and the dizziness has gone and the memory has improved greatly, but the concentration problem and extreme fatigue remain. I live in my own now in a house my dad owns right next door but I still need help with things, especially paperwork and paying bills. I can't work a regular job as of now. I have not given up hope of that someday, however I have periods of time where I can barely get out of bed. My dad is retired so we started a business flipping furniture so I work as much as I can and I make a small income, but not much. I have been told that I still have a good chance of more improvement, but recovery is harder and it takes longer, the more time that passes. I am 37 years old and I sometimes feel life is passing me by. I have gone out and met people and had 2 short relationships but ended them because I'm afraid to commit. It's lonely. I have my dad and many other family members and friends that bring me happiness and keep me going, I haven't given up, and I try to keep a positive outlook but I think how much living I missed out one when with him and now I am away from him and he is in prison, but what he did to me continues to affect me every single day. Please leave before it's too late. I know he is threatening you with jail, but please don't let him hold you hostage. If he presses charges even if you are found guilty it is not likely you would receive a jail sentence. but I would take that chance in a second to have a normal brain again and to have my life back. There are people who can help you. The domestic violence hotline is there and they can connect you with legal aid in your town. There are lawyers who will work pro bono for DV survivors. Please get to a shelter. They will know how to help you. If you don't feel you can go right away at least call the hotline and let them give you some resources. Take this from me, he will hurt you again and maybe permanently. It is not worth it and you deserve better.
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Post by Reese on Jan 26, 2019 4:54:50 GMT
How are you, Wrecked? I hope you are okay and safe right now. Thinking of you and praying for you.
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Post by thesadnessinme on Jan 26, 2019 23:00:31 GMT
Reese I just wanted to say that I'm so sorry for your experiences It makes me tearful to think of what you went through and the lasting effects it's had. You are a remarkable woman and should be so proud of the strong spirit in you. I wish you so much strength, love and peace. And Wrecked, I hope you're doing as well as you can be.
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Post by Wrecked on Feb 8, 2019 4:51:16 GMT
Hi Ladies..thanks for your responses. I left again, just 4 days ago. It just got to be too bad. He was taunting me constantly. It was only verbal at first, and after about a week of that, I decided I would simply stop responding in the hopes that he'd give up. But he realized what I was doing, and then he got physical. Of course, he knows how to hurt me without leaving mark and he said no one would believe me. When I'd try to defend myself, he'd repeat his threat to have me arrested. I knew I had to make a choice..either endure it and hope he'd get tired of the game, or free myself and risk him following through on his threats. I told myself over and over, if I left and he did follow through, then I'd face what I had to face, but at least I'd be free of him. I told myself, go, just go. I'd lay awake at night and vow to myself that tomorrow would be the day, tomorrow I would go. But when the time came, the fear paralyzed me.
Reese, thank you for sharing your story. I'm so sorry that happened to you. It tore me up inside. I read what you wrote...I read it last Friday and the very next day, my husband put his hand around my throat and he held me down. It wasn't enough to cut off my air supply, but it made me think, he could if he wanted to, he could strangle me and I could end up with a similar story or worse. It was what I needed and what gave me the courage to go and I left that night.
So I am out again, I've been out for 4 days and though I'm almost certain he knows where I am, he hasn't shown up, he's only left messages, and no one has come to arrest me. I'm okay. Just okay. Still really worried and wondering what I'm going to do now. I want to believe he was only making empty threats in order to get me to stay, but I know he has the evidence to press charges...he took pictures and saved them, he waved them in my face enough times. It's so frustrating. He has hurt me over and over again, I hit him once in self defense and because I left a mark and he didn't I'm the one who could face arrest.
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karen
Member
"Trust Your Journey"
Posts: 1,518
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Post by karen on Feb 10, 2019 1:16:21 GMT
Hey Wrecked, are you ok? Wow, you are so courageous and I am so hoping you are well! o t Honestly, I don't think you are going to get arrested, you haven't done anything wrong have you? Defending yourself is not a crime, and honestly he should be arrested for assault, what he did to you is criminal.
Please, ignore his messages and texts. You can keep them though, and build a case against HIM. Especially if he threatens you, attempts to stalk you, does any damage to your property. Don't have any contact with him. NONE. I know this is really hard, it is so tempting to answer them, to respond to their nasty or "loving" messages. Either way, DON'T. He is going to try all kinds of tactics, he is going to try and get you to come back and I promise you it will start all over again.
If you want, call the DV hotline, talk to a counselor. Call as many times as you feel you need. They can help you to stay safe, to stay away from him and can even help to possibly give you shelter and help with your next step. 1-800-799-7233.
Give yourself time to heal, time to focus on you and figure out that next step. One of the hardest things we do is REACT. Try not to react, but to realize you have power right now to control your future. I know he thinks he has evidence, he wants to hold that over your head and threaten you with it. A DV shelter can you help you to fight that in case he tries to use it. Many times though, threats are empty. My ex-husband threatened me so many times, he wanted to charge me with adultery after I left him, he threatened to hurt my kids and try to get them to hate me, he threatened to tell everyone what a fraud and fake I was, that I really wasn't a Christian because I was committing adultery. All empty threats, but all enough for me to live in fear, and I did.
I admire you Wrecked, you are making a change to make your life better. Please, please, please, try and not respond to him. He wants to get to you, but ignoring him, you are not giving him any power. Yes, it may make him mad. BUT, you can stay safe. The DV centers can help. Please go to them or at least call, they will help. You are not alone.
I am here and will help you in any way I can. Please, stay safe Wrecked. Take one day at a time, one hour at a time, give yourself some space and time to breathe, rest, and recharge. You deserve to be safe, don't let him have any say anymore in your life choices. NONE.
Hugs to you, I know you are worried, but it will be ok.
Karen
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Post by guest name on Feb 10, 2019 3:33:42 GMT
So glad to hear from you, Wrecked!
Karen made a great suggestion. Call the DV hotline or your local battered women's shelter (or one that is in another state) and get support from them. Abusers isolate their victims and make themselves the center of the victims' world and it's very hard to stay away, despite the reality of the situation, because it seems (and pretty much is) to be one's only support. But this does not need to be the case. Some battered women's shelters have extra people on staff who can easily take your call and give you support in helping you to stay away.
I think you're strong enough in the first place, though. You only went back because he forced you, under the false threat of jail time. I think it's a bluff. If he could send you to jail, he'd have done it already. I think he'll use it in the divorce, so he can paint himself the victim of you, the so-called abusive spouse. Abusers love to create that impression, paint themselves as the battered one.
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Post by Reese on Apr 28, 2019 5:38:54 GMT
Dear Wrecked, how are you? I'm glad to read that you have left and that your husband hasn't followed through on his threats. Which probably means he won't and was only bluffing. I see it's been a few months since your last post and I hope you are still safe and doing well. You are strong, courageous woman who deserves to be loved and cared for. Please update us if you can. You have been on my mind a lot. Still praying for you and wishing you only the best.
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Post by Wrecked on Apr 29, 2019 0:45:28 GMT
Hi everybody,
Good to hear from you all. I am okay. My husband messed up though. He assaulted me again but he left evidence this time and he was finally charged with a crime. Finally. He came to my friends door about a week and a half after I left last time and he sweet talked me into letting me in. I know...I should have slammed the door in his face, locked it and called 911. I was having a hard time emotionally, feeling very lonely, trying to recover from the tail end of the flu, I just didn't have it in me. He said he only wanted to talk and I believed him. After I while he asked me if I wanted to go get something to eat and I made it clear I wasn't going anywhere with him. He kept pushing me and pushing me so I got up and opened the door and told him to get out. He said I was his wife and we belong together, then he went at me for a while shoving me and shaking me, putting his hand around my chin and he told me if I told anyone that he was there, he'd press those charges. I showed him the marks he left and I told him I'd press charges against him too. He went crazy and threw me down, kicked me and I told him I'd scream. My friend lives in a close-knit neighborhood so I think that was enough to scare him off. But he said if I called the police, I'd be sorry the next time I saw him. And yet again, I couldn't believe he was capable of that level of violence, I didn't think he'd be stupid enough to leave evidence, but I was wrong.
He was arrested and at the initial hearing, his lawyer told the judge he was only defending himself, he said I had a history of violence and he showed the judge the picture of my husband's black eye. The judge asked him if he had any injuries now and when he said no, the judge said he didn't believe for a second that my husband's assault on me was self-defense. He has since bailed out of jail and agreed to a plea deal with no jail time. I had to move to a shelter. I just couldn't sleep out there. I didn't feel safe. A week after I got here, I started having nightmares which I didn't think was that off, but then they started happening while I was still awake, just as I was drifting off to sleep. And I couldn't sit still during the day, if I sat too long I'd have anxiety attacks. It was to the point that I asked to see a psychiatrist because I thought he was right and I was going crazy. The psychiatrist had a name for the waking nightmares, which isn't coming to me at the moment but it has to do with PTSD. After 3 visits the psychiatrist told me it was his professional opinion that I didn't need a psychiatrist and I was absolutely not crazy or going crazy. He told me what was going on was completely normal given everything I had been through. He suggested a licensed therapist or social worker who specialized in DV, just as the shelter had offered me in the very beginning. I cried so hard when he told me that, I was so relieved. I realized that all those people who said I wasn't crazy were telling me the truth and it was only HIM (my husband) who was lying to me. I still hear my husband's voice in my head at times but it's getting better and I haven't had a nightmare in almost 3 weeks. I'm working on finding part time work, I'm enrolling in online classes at the community college for this fall, and the shelter is helping me to get rental assistance and financial aid. I feel like things are finally turning around for me.
I want to thank you all for your advice and support over the last several months. Some days can't believe I'm actually out and free and you guys had a lot to do with me getting up the courage to leave.
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karen
Member
"Trust Your Journey"
Posts: 1,518
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Post by karen on May 1, 2019 3:13:41 GMT
Hey Wrecked! WOW..sounds like the last few months have been so up and down for you! I am glad he was arrested and it is very comforting to hear that the judge didn't believe him! YAY! He should have kept him in jail, but knowing it was a possibility sometimes helps us to know justice has been served.
Please still be careful though, he may not give up and still try and get to you.
I am so happy for you that you are getting all the support you need! Going to school is such a good thing, and finding work, all stuff that says you are a good person and deserve to take care of yourself! You are free and you deserve all the good things that are happening to you right now. I knew all along you were not crazy! WE are not the crazy ones..THEY are. We are victims and then we are survivors..never are we crazy!
I am also really glad your nightmares have stopped. They are a symptom of PTSD..but having a symptom doesn't always mean you have full PTSD. We can have the symptoms though..I did. I had a few symptoms, but was never diagnosed fully with the disorder. I was definitely traumatized and that can be different for everyone.
Wrecked..you are very welcome, I am just so happy for you! I am glad this forum is here and it helps people like you and me! Being free and knowing we had the strength to leave...that is priceless!. Keep going forward Wrecked! One day at a time!
Karen
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